What was your reception of Dr. Dawson throughout Euvon's Journey?
Janet Jones:
Once we left the other oncologist, there was such a contrast when we walked into Dr. Dawson's office. It was like a hoo. It was just different. The other oncologist was good, but we just felt emotionally cramped. But when we walked in her office, it was like she was dealing with a cold and not a deadly disease. And so, she just made us feel comfortable. We were like, "Ooh, we're home." And even though the diagnosis was still so poor, the one thing that she did say that was encouraging yet troubling was that you don't qualify for chemo, radiation, or surgery. It'll just mess up your life. So, why don't we just start here? So, I was like, "Oh, okay. You don't qualify, but we can do this."
And we were like, "Oh, okay. You know, there's some hope." And just her presentation gave us hope, even though it was a dark hope. Maybe there's a miracle in there somewhere, but she was so casual, but to the point. You know, she never just... Whereas the other oncologist was like, "Well, I do have good news and bad news. You do have, but..." But she was like, "Well, we're not doing chemo. We're not doing radiation. We're not doing surgery. You can keep that prostate. It's horrible. It's horrible. And we'll start doing some hormonal therapy." We're like, "Well, what's that?" So, it was just a feeling of she was really going to help us.
As a clinician, how do you support the caregiver?
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
I like to be inclusive and try to make both of them feel comfortable. And it really depends upon... When he started doing well, he mostly came by himself. Part of what happens when I first meet a couple when they come together, could be husband and wife, could be a different relationship. I try to figure out what their relationship is, what their decision-making is. Sometimes, it's someone sitting there just sort of nodding, doesn't say anything. Sometimes you can see, and sometimes it's just in the way they look at each other, body language, or you can see whether they're working together. Sometimes you can get the sense of, are they going to make a decision together or independently?
And so, there's not really a one size fits all. I mean, it really depends upon them because whoever comes into your office, they're already in a relationship. They're already married or whatever their relationship is. That relationship long preceded my meeting them. And so, I have to know what their relationship is and how they're going to work together so that I can determine how best. I try to be very inclusive, but you find it's always different. Actually, probably one of the things that goes through my mind when a person with newly diagnosed metastatic disease walks into my office is whether they brought someone with them. I've always found it a little bit unusual for me, because it's not what I would do.
If someone walks into my office with newly diagnosed metastatic disease and they're by themselves, and I usually say... I sort of pause it. I said, "Oh, is there anyone with you or you came by yourself?" Because I think when you're dealing with this, if you don't have a partner, it would be so much harder. And it's actually, the more you share in it and the more... And sharing is different for everyone. Sometimes, it's just being supportive. Sometimes, it's even just sitting there and being quiet. But I think having a person that is your partner in this makes it easier, just makes it easier.
How has Euvon changed from the moment of diagnosis to today?
Janet Jones:
He's pretty much the same. Throughout his treatment, he's been able to continue working and continuing to be independent. And I've given him that privilege of being who he is. He's still jovial and happy, grateful. He talks about when he's going, preparing for his visit to the hospital, he seems like he's going to see his other woman. He's excited. Never seen a gentleman so excited about going to see his doctor as he is about going to see Dr. Dawson. And I'm like, "Have a wonderful time," because I just trust that she's going to be honest with him, that she cares about him, and I can let him go and just trust that he's going to be okay.
Regardless of the conversation or how it may go, I trust that he's going to be okay. And if she says it's gotten worse, he's still going to be okay because she's the kind of person who will still give you some kind of hope. So, we're going to try this. We're going to try that. Or you might want to prepare for your funeral, but she's going to say it in a way that's going to make you say, "Okay." I'm going to find a nice little casket.
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
That's funny.
Janet Jones:
That's the personality that she has, and it works well with his personality. So, together, I can say, "See ya, be safe with Jesus name in the car." But when you get to Dr. Dawson, he's going to be okay.
As a caregiver, how important is it to trust your spouse's doctor and care team?
Janet Jones:
It's the most important thing and it's more important for me to have the confidence that he's going to be taken care of because the patient sometimes goes in from my understanding with, I don't know what to think. It's them who's going through the issue, going through the pain, going through the diagnosis, so they can be all over the place. I have to have the confidence that my husband's being taken care of. And from the onset, we had that confidence. And I have retained it to the point where I don't feel that I need to be with him when he sees her. That they're going to have their conversation, she's going to be honest, he's going to be honest. They have fun doing it and I'm good.
As a clinician, how much does caregiver trust factor into the treatment plan?
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
Obviously, it's important to me that the spouse, the caregiver, feels confident in me, but I'm treating them together, but I'm also, in this case Euvon, he's the patient. And so, he's the focus and then it's sort of what is around him is always taken into consideration. It could be a child. It could be his mother. It could be almost anyone, but the other people are important. They're his support system, but he's actually the center. So, I take it into consideration, but they're his support system. I did want to talk about though when he first came in and how he changed. And in fact, everything you said is true.
From my perspective, what changed was is when he came in the door, he was scared because he didn't know what was ahead of him and he didn't have a navigator. And over time, he still doesn't know what's ahead of him, but now he has somebody he trusts that they're going to navigate him through it. And so, the difference is, he knows that if he loses his course or starts to go in a different direction, that I'm going to try to straighten him back out and that takes some of the fear away. And that's so I would say he's changed in that his fear that he's there navigating this by himself is no longer there. That's what I would say.
What are your thoughts on Janet's book?
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
When he first brought me the book, I thought he had written it and he said, "I want you to read this book and make some comments and what do you think about it, et cetera." And I said, "Oh, this is a book...?" "No, I didn't write this book. Janet wrote this book."
Janet Jones:
It was actually a manuscript.
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
A manuscript. That's right.
Janet Jones:
It's a manuscript.
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
He brought me a manuscript. That's right. He brought me a manuscript.
Janet Jones:
I wanted to make sure I was saying everything in the right way.
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
Right. But I mean, it was such an unusual event that actually I didn't even, it didn't even register that he hadn't written it. I would just assume it was his journey. But he said, "No, no, it's through Jan's eyes." And he was very proud of that and he is very proud of that.
Janet Jones:
Yeah.
Final Thoughts
Janet Jones:
I will appreciate Dr. Dawson for the remainder of my life. And if I ever get prostate cancer, she's going to be the one that I come to see.
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
I will take care of you. And I just want you to know it's a little... Everybody always asks me every time they come to see me for the last 10 years, I always get, "Are you retiring soon? You can't retire." And I had jokingly said, "Well, I'm trying to decide what I'm going to do in my retirement. I'm going to specialize in female prostate cancer." So, don't worry, I'm there for you.
Janet Jones:
I'm going to try to grow one. I'm going to tell the Lord, "You can take these and give me a prostate because I want to be with Dr. Dawson or either, you need to take our breast cancer."
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
Or one of the other.
Janet Jones:
And I want you to research it.
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
That's funny.
Janet Jones:
It's been a blessing because we've been allowed... One doctor has said, "It's not about how long do you have. It's about living while you're here." It's about enjoying life. Don't worry about how much time do you have. You want to live. If you live five months, let that be the best five months. You may want to see a wedding. You want to see another birth. You want to be out more. So, don't worry about dying. Worry about deal with living.
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
Right, exactly.
Janet Jones:
And so, that's been our journey, just celebrating life and understanding that we're going to always be in a mysterious journey through life and nobody's getting out of here alive.
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
That's right. That's why I always say to people when these conversations come up, I said, "Just remember, you're alive every day that you're alive."
Janet Jones:
That's right. That's right.
Dr. Nancy Dawson:
So, live it.
Janet Jones:
Mm-hmm.